Ep #428: Surprise Episode

Stacey Brown Randall:  Hey there. Do you love referrals but hate asking for them? Well, then you’ve come to the right place.

This is the Roadmap to Referrals podcast, and I’m your host, Stacey Brown Randall. For this episode, I’m gonna ask you to take a walk down memory lane with me. This episode will share knowledge and guidance on referrals, but with a little bit of a twist.

If you follow along with my life, whether that’s on social media, or maybe it’s something that I mention in like a weekly email, or maybe on a training, or quite possibly in one of these podcast episodes, you know that the Randall household has entered a new era.

We have two boys off to their freshman year of college, and our daughter is in her junior year of high school. That, if you’re counting, it’s two years away from an empty nest, but no one’s counting in this household at all, promise.

Yep, don’t worry. Okay, so as you can imagine though, I have been doing a lot of walking down memory lane, like a lot, in prepping for this episode, which was going to be about the referral fundamentals. But don’t worry, it’s coming.

We’re gonna do that next week. But it hit me in my prep that there was a time in the past when I had my kids on the podcast, and they served as guest hosts, asking me listener-submitted questions, maybe even a question you’ve submitted in the past.

So for this episode, because we’re doing a lot of walking down memory lane, we did a compilation of those questions, and my kids being the interviewer with me in the hot seat.

So there are three episodes. They were episodes 30, episode 40, and episode 50, which was way back in 2019, like not even a year, coming up on a year of even having the podcast.

So at the time, my kids were 11, 10, and eight years old. They were babies. Okay, not really.

But we took one question from each of their episodes that I actually think the answers are still relevant for you today, and I think that they are things you need to know today, and we did a mashup for this episode.

So one question from each of their episodes, so you’ll get to hear from each of them, but also get the answers to the questions that they ask me in this mashup for this episode.

We will also link to those episodes. If you wanna go back and listen to each of the full episodes, we will link to the episodes below the video, of course, if you’re watching this on YouTube, and then on the show notes page at StaceyBrownRandall.com/428.

Think about that, 428 episodes, and we are pulling things from episodes 30, 40, and 50. Time flies. Okay, one thing to note though.

Back in 2019, right, if you’ve been around for a while with this podcast, you know the podcast was audio only. There wasn’t any video.

So I know if you like watching the episodes or you like watching these videos on YouTube, you don’t wanna stare at just a picture of me for the entire episode.

So enjoy our compilation of pictures while you watch this episode on YouTube. And heck, if you’re listening to this in your earbuds right now in your favorite podcast listening app, it may be worth it to just also go watch it on YouTube.

I mean, I’m kind of partial. They’re really cool pictures and cute pictures, but if you want, go check out the pictures. If not, it’s still gonna be a great educational referral-based episode as well.

Okay, so for the questions, we went in order of the episodes, episode 30, 40, and 50. So first up is Jacob, and at the time he was 10 years old. He’s 18, freshman in college.

Then it’s gonna be followed by McKenzie, who at the time was eight years old, and she’s still as spunky as ever. She’s 16 now and trying to drive, and we’re trying to keep her from it.

And then of course, followed up with Danny, who was at that time 11 years old. He’s almost 19, and he’s also a freshman in college. It’s crazy to think.

All right, so my friends, here are my kids. Enjoy as we teach you a little bit more about referrals.

Jacob Randall:  Hi, I’m Jacob Randall, and Stacey Brown Randall is my mom. She invited me on her podcast today to be the one asking her your questions about referrals and growing your business. Here we go.

And our final question from Caitlin, a photographer from Wisconsin. How do I get more comfortable reaching out to people and make it less awkward to get referrals?

I hate to make it obvious that I’m looking for more business because I feel that it makes me look desperate and not worth my prices.

Stacey Brown Randall:  Great job, Jacob, thank you. All right, Caitlin, thanks so much for your question.

So I think your question is a lot like Bob’s question, and his question, of course, being about being authentic and being able to still generate referrals.

And your question, I think, is hitting straight at the heart of the advice you’ve probably heard when it comes to referrals is that you have to ask.

And it is that asking for referrals, that reaching out and asking people for referrals, that makes it extremely awkward and uncomfortable. And I get it.

I mean, I think the reason why we feel desperate when we’re asking for referrals or when we’re asking people to send us business, the reason why we look desperate is because we kind of are.

I know that there are people out there who will teach you that feeling like you look desperate when you’re asking for referrals means that you have some head trash that you have to get over. You’ve got your own issues you need to deal with.

I just don’t think that’s true. I think that when the majority of people feel a certain way about a certain action they’re trying to take, those majority of people are typically right.

We do feel desperate and awkward and most of the time uncomfortable when we’re sitting across from someone, whether we know them well or not, and then we’re asking them to give us a referral or asking them to send business to us by referral.

And here’s the piece that most people can’t articulate but why I think it’s so important that we never ask.

When you are asking someone to send you a referral, what you’re effectively doing is commoditizing your relationship with them. You’re automatically making your relationship with them very transactional and you’re basically giving them work to do.

And so what people can’t really articulate but you can see in their reactions is once you ask somebody to help you out and send you some referrals, you can see them physically get uncomfortable.

They sit back in their chairs, they shift uncomfortably, they try to wrap up the meeting as fast as possible because what they’re trying to do is distance themselves from your request.

Now, this is different when you ask somebody to give you a testimonial or a review. Unless they’ve just had a horrible experience and they’ve been lying to you and never told you, most people are more willing not to be put out or put off by that request.

So what’s the difference between asking for a testimonial or asking for a review versus asking for a referral? Well, the difference is in terms of what I’m asking you to do.

When I’m asking you for a review or a testimonial, I’m asking you to put your name on something that isn’t going any further than you putting your name on something.

Yes, it’ll be used in my marketing, but it’s not like that marketing’s then gonna be handed to someone you know and your reputation’s gonna be put on the line with somebody in particular.

When we ask for a referral, we are asking that person to put their reputation on the line for someone they know, someone who has a name and a face and someone who probably on some level means something to them.

So when we ask them for a referral, we are making our relationship very commodity-driven, very transactional. We’re asking them to do work for us.

And at the same time, what we’re not recognizing is, is that most of the time, people aren’t interested in sending us referrals.

They only send us referrals when they know somebody who has a problem and they know you happen to be able to solve it.

So using Caitlin as our example here, being a photographer, Caitlin as a photographer, nobody actually needs to talk to you, Caitlin, unless they need photos taken, right?

Unless they’re looking for a photographer, they really have, no matter how awesome you are, Caitlin, and I bet you’re awesome, they really have no need to talk to you unless they’re really looking for a photographer.

So when you ask somebody, hey, can you send me some business? That person automatically has to think about, well, who do I know that actually is looking for a photographer and what does that look like?

And that makes everyone uncomfortable because they have to start thinking about putting their reputation on the line for someone they know.

So Caitlin, here’s the thing. I don’t think you should be asking for referrals. Same kind of answer that I gave Bob. And I think there’s something different you need to do instead.

And specifically, I think you need to follow a process of how you generate referrals through relationship building and focused on being memorable and meaningful with your referral sources or the people who should be your referral sources.

And making sure that you are being memorable and meaningful with them, making your outreach and your touch points about them and making sure that it’s helping you stay top of mind by the right language that you’re using and how often you actually do these different outreach or these different touch points.

That’s an important part you’re going to have to remember. Now I teach this five-step process. You can find it on the podcast.

I think it was episode 15 where I talked about the five steps to generate referrals. My entire book, Generating Business Referrals Without Asking is based on those five steps.

And of course, I have an article on my website as well. And I would definitely direct you to go to StaceyBrownRandall.com/5steps.

And you can find information on what does it look like to actually generate referrals without asking because in that time and place when we’re not asking for referrals and we’re receiving them, we get to stay in a place where we get to be authentic and everything in life, at least for our business and growing it and getting more clients becomes easier.

So you’re not wrong and there’s nothing wrong with you that you feel desperate when you’re reaching out and asking people for referrals or you’re reaching out and asking them to help you with your business, right? There is a different way.

Now, here’s the thing. I definitely also think you need to know how you’re gonna grow your business while you’re waiting for your referrals to actually start working.

Referrals takes a little bit longer. So you’re going to need some prospecting or other marketing tactics that are gonna help you bring in clients because you probably need to eat next month.

And so you probably need some clients that are gonna actually pay you. So you’re gonna have to do a mix of activities to actually bring in new clients.

But don’t underestimate and don’t ignore building up those relationships with people who can send you referrals and using the right language and doing the right touch points with them and making what you do about them because eventually they will start to refer you.

And obviously at that point, you’ll be ready for it and you will never have put anybody out by asking them for it. So Caitlin, excellent, excellent question.

So Jacob, what’d you think of those three questions that everybody asked us?

Jacob Randall:  Well, I don’t really know what any of those questions are because I don’t do any of this stuff, but I think they’re good questions for my mom.

Stacey Brown Randall: Thank you, buddy. That is awesome. Spoken like a true Randall. Absolutely, good job, buddy. I am so proud of you. Do you have anything else that you wanna say to folks before I wrap up this episode?

Jacob Randall: No.

Stacey Brown Randall: Okay.

McKenzie Randall Hello, my name is Ella McKenzie Randall, but you can call me McKenzie.

I’m Stacey Brown Randall’s daughter. She invited me on her podcast to ask her your questions about referrals and growing your business. Let’s do this.

Question number two is a mashup from Josh, a lawyer in Salt Lake City, and Amy, an interior designer in Baltimore. They ask close to the same question.

Josh and Amy want to know, how do you move someone from a trusted contact to a source of referrals? Or generate initial referrals without asking?

Stacey Brown Randall: All right, great question from Josh and Amy. I appreciate you guys thinking about, okay, we want referrals, but how are we going to turn somebody into a referral source?

We know we have contacts who trust us, but now we wanna move them into someone who’s actually sending us referrals. And I think that the other question when you think about it is those initial referrals without asking.

I always tell folks we’re just trying to get to that first referral. And then when we have that first referral, we put them into a referral generating plan, which is what I teach in the Growth by Referrals program to start cultivating more referrals from them.

So ultimately what we’re looking for is to get to that first referral. So the question is perfect because it’s a step before that. Well, how do you get people to start referring you for the first time?

And I think what’s really important that we have to pay attention to is recognizing how we turn people who are not referring us into referral sources.

Now, I have a masterclass entirely on this topic and it is called Increasing your Referral Sources. And it’s a masterclass where the first part of the masterclass, we focus on how we turn clients into referral sources.

So clients that aren’t referring us yet and how we turn them into referral sources. And then we take the second part of the training, and we focus on centers of influence.

You know, people in our network, not our whole network, but a subset of our network. And how do we turn them into referral sources?

It does come down for us paying attention to the language that we use. And then of course the actions that we’re taking. But I do want you guys to think about it from this perspective first.

It first comes down to, well, we need to identify who would be somebody who could potentially refer us. If you have a trusted contact, then we need to make sure you can identify them.

You need to make sure you’re building a relationship with them. And then you need to make sure that when you’re having conversations with them, you are trying to figure out how to help them.

That’s the initial first step is always about giving, making sure you identified who they are and you know why you’ve identified them.

If they had a great experience with you, well, then they could turn into a client who could become a referral source. And so you have to think about kind of those initial steps.

Who are they? Why are you picking them? Start with a really small group and then realize, well, how strong is that relationship that you have?

And the one place where the training kind of picks up, that masterclass that picks up, is it really focuses in on, okay, so what are the actions that you take? And what is the language that you use as you move through that process?

So I’ll link to the masterclass inside the show notes for this episode, which of course is StaceyBrownRandall.com/40. That’s the number 40. And don’t forget, Stacey has an E.

But I’ll link to that masterclass if you wanna check out more about it. But remember, it comes down to identifying who is the person or the people that you wanna turn into referral sources.

Why are you identifying them? Because you’re gonna wanna use some of that language when you’re having conversations with them. And then checking out the type of relationship you have with them and how you start building on it.

But this really does come down to the time you spend, how you give and take care of them, and the language that you use that’ll initial or hopefully trigger that very first referral.

Danny Randall: Hi, I’m Danny Randall, and this is another question and answer episode. I’ll be your guest interviewer asking your questions. Let’s dive in.

Our final question is from Linda Koch, a financial services professional. She asked, my biggest challenge on referrals is how to generate referrals from associations and not just clients.

Stacey Brown Randall: Okay, Linda. And by the way, if Danny and I maybe said your last name wrong, we’re so sorry. We did practice a couple of times.

We weren’t quite sure if we were pronouncing it right. But Linda, thank you so much.

So here’s what I wanna know. Based on your question, your biggest challenge is that you wanna generate referrals from associations and not just your clients.

And you know, I talk about that you can generate referrals from clients and centers of influence, which are basically people in your network who aren’t a client, but they know what you do, and they come across your ideal client.

But in both cases here, clients and centers of influence, they’re people, they’re humans, first and last names.

So when you ask your question about how to generate referrals from associations, here’s kind of what I want you to understand.

It’s really important to know that referrals don’t come from an institution, they don’t come from a company, and they don’t come from an association. They come from people who work within those associations, institutions, and companies.

So just like you need to build a relationship with your clients, or maybe your centers of influence, to turn them into referral sources, you need to do the same thing with a contact, a person, a human, at that association where you want to start receiving referrals.

So your very first step, of course, is to start by identifying the person who in that association is in the best position to refer you.

Then follow the process to turn, and as you guys know, I teach this process in Increasing Your Referral Sources Masterclass, follow the process to turn those folks who are not referring you into referral sources.

So if you do want to receive referrals from an association, it’s to start to define the person there, and then, of course, building a relationship with them, using the right referral seed language, make sure you’re planting the right seeds, and then, of course, turning that non-referral into a referral source.

But here’s one thing I do want you to note, Linda, and for everybody listening who’s thinking to themselves, yes, I want referrals from associations or companies and institutions too.

If this association has a preferred vendor list that they use when somebody says, hey, who would you recommend that I go with?

And they have this preferred vendor list or this preferred list of people that they will recommend, the reality of it is, you’re gonna have to then get on that list.

So some companies will have parameters or boundaries or even rules around who we let our employees, right, who we let our employees actually refer or actually recommend.

And so if they do it from a list perspective, like, hey, you gotta be on the list for us to refer you, then your job is to get on the list.

Now, you can still, and there’s probably a process and a procedure to get on the list, and you have to figure out what that looks like, right?

Like, for instance, I was referred in to an organization that actually has a Speakers’ Bureau list for all their members to go to when they wanna bring in speakers for their groups. It’s a mastermind organization for Christian business owners.

And so I, even though I was referred in to go speak to one group in particular, he was like, hey, for you to speak to all the other groups, we’ve gotta get you on our preferred list.

So I had to go through the process, fill out the application, go through all the, jump through all the hoops, whatever it looks like, to get on that preferred list.

Now, the truth is, I know being on that preferred list does not mean I’m gonna absolutely pick up some speaking engagements within this organization.

I know the people who in the group that I was referred to, where I did my first presentation, they’ll be the ones who end up, if they obviously like it, they’ll be the ones end up talking to other people and recommending me to other people.

And because I’m on the list, it’ll be an easy way for them to refer me. Not being on the list would make it a little bit harder. So that’s just one thing to note.

So if the association has a preferred vendor list and you wanna be on it, as thinking as they don’t refer anyone who’s not on the list, there are rules around them being unable to refer anyone not on the list, you need to get on the list.

And then you need to recognize, when you’re on a list like this, they don’t just give your name in a situation, they give all the names in a situation.

So that comes down to having other champions within that organization saying, hey, I know you got the list of preferred vendors or preferred speakers or preferred professionals, hey, go with Linda, right?

You definitely still want those champions inside the organization. So definitely figure out their process first, get yourself on the list, and then start figuring out how to make an impact within that organization to have specific people refer you.

Because remember, most important, referrals do not come from companies, they don’t come from associations. Referrals come from humans. It is H to H, human to human.

You are always referred by somebody else. And that’s the most important part for you to remember and for you to recognize. So that’s an excellent question. It’s not the easiest thing to do, but Linda, I have full faith in your ability.

All right, Danny, those were our three questions for this episode. Is there anything else you want to add?

Danny Randall: Can I go home now?

Stacey Brown Randall: I’m kinda not surprised that’s what Danny asked. Danny, seriously, this hasn’t been the most fun you’ve ever had on a Sunday afternoon?

Danny Randall: No.

Stacey Brown Randall: This kid is nothing if not honest. That is true.

What’s interesting about doing Danny with this episode is, as I first asked Jacob, my son, to do the episode, and he did it, I think, somewhat willingly just because I asked.

Then my daughter McKenzie got annoyed that I didn’t ask her first and she couldn’t wait to come on and do the interview. She was like practicing reading her questions for like two days prior to coming on.

And Danny did it, I think, just because he knew everybody else had and he’s just being an awesome, sweet sport. So, Danny, I appreciate you. Thank you so much for being a good sport.

Stacey Brown Randall: Okay, McKenzie, so that wraps up the three questions for this episode. So, how do you think I did?

McKenzie Randall: Excellent.

Stacey Brown Randall: Really? Why, thank you so much. Okay, well, since this was a Q&A type session, do you have any other questions or any questions you think we missed or any questions that you have for me?

McKenzie Randall: Yes. When can we get a dog?

Stacey Brown Randall: Oh my gosh, I can’t believe you just asked that on the podcast. Now I have to tell everybody, all my listeners, that I don’t want a dog. I definitely don’t want a dog.

McKenzie Randall: We’re getting a dog. I know we’re getting a dog.

Stacey Brown Randall: You heard it here, folks. McKenzie thinks we’re getting a dog. I just don’t know if I can do a dog.

It’s like another human in the house. I don’t know. I had dogs growing up, a dog growing up, when I was very, very young and we’ve never had one since.

And my kids, I know, look at that. You guys can’t see this, but she’s giving me puppy dog eyes right now, like the begging for a dog.

They’ve been asking now for over a year. Does that make me a really bad mom if I don’t let you get a dog?

McKenzie Randall: Yes.

Stacey Brown Randall: I don’t know if you heard it, but she said yes. That’s so funny.

Okay, so little insights into the Randall family about our debate about whether or not we’re getting a dog. Unfortunately, mom, me, is the last holdout of not wanting to get one.

Stacey Brown Randall: Thanks for indulging me on this walk down memory lane and still being able to teach you about referrals. The advice I gave way back in 2019 hasn’t changed in 2026. And it won’t.

It’s because referrals come from relationships. They are not an algorithm you can manipulate. And there’s just some things that stand the test of time when it comes to human-to-human relationships.

Okay, all the episodes that we referenced are linked below the video. And of course, can be found on the show notes page for this episode, which is StaceyBrownRandall.com/428.

Remember, please, if you like this video, leave a five-star rating for the episode and subscribe to the show, whether you’re doing that on YouTube or on your favorite podcast app.

I also love feedback. So drop me a comment below. Bye for now.